Author Topic: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board  (Read 5058 times)

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Offline Pete

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2021, 01:29:23 am »
I took the transformer out of the inverter and found a label on it, it say it is an 18 volt to 240 transformer.
There were fairly long leads on it so I wound 1 more turn around the core, and the highest output I could get was 204 volts.
Seems that I will have to wait until tomorrow and try unwinding one turn from the original and see what difference that makes.
Like I said the Sunyima  boards want 12 to 14 volts on the primary, so will see what tomorrow brings
pete

Offline Pete

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #16 on: November 04, 2021, 11:25:16 pm »
With a bit of help and experimenting it works.
Turns out that taking two turns off the primary of the transformer was what was needed.
My head was trying to tell me that I needed to add turns to get more voltage out, but the reverse ended up being true.
So now I can wind it up to 240 volts and it only draws 0.8 amps on idle.
I found another torroid inductor core in my shed and added a second inductor to the primary and it hums so quietly that it is hard to tell it is on at all.
Pete

Offline rossw

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #17 on: November 05, 2021, 04:58:54 am »
My head was trying to tell me that I needed to add turns to get more voltage out, but the reverse ended up being true.

You need to remember that it's a "RATIO" device.

If it has 10 turns on the primary and 200 turns on the secondary, then it'd be a 1:20 ratio.
If you put 12V in the primary you'd expect 20* that on the secondary (240)

To get more volts out, you have to increase the RATIO, which means either adding more turns on the secondary (eg, adding 40 turns on the secondary would make it 10:240 = 1:24) or reducing turns on the primary (eg, taking two off would make it 8:200 = 1:25)

Offline Pete

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #18 on: November 05, 2021, 04:38:21 pm »
Thanks Ross, my muddled thinking at first was that a 1:1 transformer had the same turns on the primary and secondary.
So at first I tried increasing the primary winding by one turn. That failed dismally.
Then I took one turn off and things looked rosier.
So I took two off and it worked fine.
I am guessing that taking turns off increases the primary current and therefore the magnetic flux.
I didn't see much on an increase in idle current so am pretty happy with how it worked out.
Now I just have to do some wiring changes so that I can quickly change inverters by moving plugs in the event of a failure.
thanks
Pete

Offline rossw

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #19 on: November 05, 2021, 07:05:51 pm »
Thanks Ross, my muddled thinking at first was that a 1:1 transformer had the same turns on the primary and secondary.

Well yes, a 1:1 transformer would have the same number of turns on primary and secondary, otherwise it wouldn't be 1:1 :)

Quote
I am guessing that taking turns off increases the primary current and therefore the magnetic flux.

It shouldn't significantly change the current in and of itself.
In an "ideal" transformer, the power into the primary will be transferred perfectly to the secondary, even in an air-cored transformer (with no iron or ferrite core). If you put in 1 watt on one side, you'd get one watt out the other side, and this is where the turns ratio comes in to play.
If you have 10 turns on the primary, or 100 turns, or 1000 turns, doesn't matter. If you have the same on the secondary (so it would be a 1:1 RATIO), if you put in 1 watt at 10 volts, that's 100mA of current in the primary, and also 10 volts at 100mA out the secondary.
If you had 1:10 ratio (so 10 turns primary and 100 secondary, or 100 primary and 1000 secondary), the voltage out the secondary will be 10 times what is on the primary. (Think if each turn as a single turn winding, all connected in series like tiny little batteries).
With a 1:10 (step-up), 1W at 10V in will produce 1W at 100V out (so only 10mA).

Connecting the transformer the opposite way (calling the secondary the "primary") would make it 10:1 (stepdown).
100V in would give 10V out, at 10 times the current. (This is how welders get such high current).

I'll leave CTs (Current Transformers) as a thought exercise. If you have a single turn primary (typically a busbar or conductor) and some thousands of turns (for the secondary), why the burden resistor is absolutely critical, even though it may be passing very low current!

Offline Pete

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #20 on: November 05, 2021, 08:52:31 pm »
Thanks again Ross, I get you. I have been changing wiring over today, to make it easy to connect either of my inverters quickly.
The 1:1 transformer I was thinking of was an isolation transformer.
Somehow even though i know the transformer equations my brain did not follow on.
Once I measured the voltages things became clearer.
Thanks again
Pete

Offline lighthunter

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #21 on: November 06, 2021, 05:38:21 am »
Good work Pete, you wont regret getting that one set up right. Im convinced the 8010 units can run for years with zero failures. Very few PJs can say that at least the earlier ones. Seem to have sold a lot of replacement parts. :)
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Offline Pete

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #22 on: November 06, 2021, 04:23:22 pm »
Thanks LH, I did the chip deletion act on the 8010 board last night. Today is testing day.
After having two different powerjacks blow up a couple of times , I now see them as good for their transformers.
As we are totally off grid I want to have reliable inverters and also spares.
So now i have two 8010 based inverters , a 3kw and a 5kw. ( realistically on 24 volt I would not rate them past 2 and 3kw.
I also have a 2.3 kw Latronics inverter, so spares are there for blowups if they happen.
I have them setup now with 175 amp anderson plugs so that they are fast changeover.
Thanks for the help in the past and advice about Oz's modifications.
I did find a torroid inductor core and added it to the other transformer leg.
One thing I noticed is that the 8kw PowerJack transformer is wound with aluminium. They must have done that for cheapness and ease of winding the primary I guess.
Cheers
Pete

Offline Pete

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #23 on: November 17, 2021, 04:08:18 pm »
Just wondering if any of you that have 8010 based inverters have checked how much load they can carry.
With my 5kw board it shuts down claiming low voltage input. I have checked and watched it when it does and it shuts down at around 23.7 volts input.
I have tried adjusting the low voltage cutout pot but it makes no difference.
This happens when running a 2300 watt kettle.
I am thinking that I may have to take the board out and trace the circuit to allow the low voltage cutout to be adjusted more.
The kettle runs when the sun is out but when we really want it to work first thing in the morning it says NO. Once the panels lift the voltage it is fine.
Hope all is well with everyone
Pete

Offline noneyabussiness

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #24 on: November 18, 2021, 01:38:22 pm »
personally,  I bypassed the op amp shut down for that but sorry can't remember exactly how... board is buried now.. but possible... would kick in under heavy loads and just got annoying..

Offline Pete

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #25 on: November 18, 2021, 03:14:35 pm »
Thanks for the reply noneya. It does sound like a good idea.
I am looking at tracing out where the pot connects to and seeing if i can either change the pot or add a resistor to allow more adjustment.
Or maybe just delete the op amp.
Thanks again
Pete

Offline lighthunter

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #26 on: November 18, 2021, 06:23:22 pm »
Hi Pete!

My thoughts on your question are...   look at the red LED when it shuts down. There are several possibilities as listed in the EGS002 datasheet. My guess is yours is shutting down from low AC output voltage so adjusting the pot for the dc minimum will have no effect.

On the other hand maybe youve already done this and know its low DC volts triggering it. I can run my 48v 5500w board down to 46v equal to 23v for yours with no issue. I did have to lower my AC output setpoint to 214v to get there so when i hit 48V im still close to 240v and drops with input DC to 214/107 at 46. Another controller switches it to grid at battery % so unless very heavily loaded on the lead acid, it never operates there. Ive not seeen outgoing loads more than 2500w but it backcharges to 4000 on a regular basis. I did see one fail at 5kw backcharging so guessin that be a number to stay away from.

One other thought, my 12xhy4008 boards are rated for 5500w at 48v but 3000 at 24v since the current is double so keep that in mind. Yours may be different.

:)

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Offline Pete

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #27 on: November 18, 2021, 07:20:59 pm »
Thanks LH, my board is flashing the code for low input DC voltage. 4 flashes then a gap then flashes again. Then it tries to start again and shuts itself down.
It only happens with a 2300 watt and above load.
I will try lowering the output voltage and see if it makes any difference.
Thanks
Pete

Offline Pete

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #28 on: November 18, 2021, 07:43:48 pm »
Hi again LH, do you know of a way to prevent the inverter shutting down from low input voltage?
If I read your post right it sounds like you are using your inverters as chargers sometimes too. So far I have enough panels that I have not needed to use a charger, but it would be great if it were possible to use the inverter as a charger too.
Is my understanding correct and what precautions are necessary?
thanks
Pete

Offline noneyabussiness

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Re: 8010 based 5kw chinese sinewave mosfet inverter board
« Reply #29 on: November 19, 2021, 01:15:41 am »
oh.. right output ac voltage " dropping " too low... basically means its at " full " pwm % and votage on pin 13 dropping below roughly 3v... if you are using a old PJ transformer,  the winding ratio is not correct ( eg8010 doesn't have as much dynamic range as the PJ) so, 28v primary to 240v secondary the sweet spot for 48v ( half it for 24v) ... personally got around this like lighthunter did and dropped output voltage to match ..

also what lighthunter is referring to, is " ac coupling " the output of the off grid inverter, to a " on grid " inverter... there are many threads on this subject, so I suggest to do some seaching  / reading... basically means the OGI support the off grid inverter,  but any excess power above what is being used charges batteries..