testing the egs002 inverter board

[ClockmanFrance]

Hi Oztules,

Good to see the OzControl Board in action, good Pics.

I have tided it some, and improved the silk screen, (now lots of info on the board for building) and scraped that original PDF on the board. I think it can stay a single sided board?, but as you say pilot holes in the copper mask help folk when they are drilling, so duly amended, silly me, Mrs says that I should get out more.
Not easy here in France at present as everyone, Power, Transport etc, is on strike and Petrol is difficult to get.

Interesting to read your comments on voltage stabilisation and how forgiving the board is, especially on the 10uf Ceramic Caps distortion.

Yes, I agree on the Nano thing, probably a 'Frackers' thing, we are not stuffed if we loose the 8010 chip, then a Nano could be re-configured.

I look forward to your comments on the New Power Board.

Dr Zogg,
I am a fail safe type of Guy. I kept my cooling circuit away from the Control and Power board, and gave it a regulated supply from the main Batteries,  that way if there was a problem with a fan failure or something gets hot, then the cooling circuit is not effected and carries on, and compensates the cooling with the other Fans.

I found with the OzInverter that the Toroid and Power Boards need different cooling, so I have 2 of OzCooling circuits, a double board. A Push & pull fan for the Power Boards and push pull for the Toroid and 2 temp sensors each.

[Dr_Zogg]

ok then, if there is not 12v present on the control board there is no harm in running the converter.
i am just trying to tidy mine up a bit an limit the amount of sub assemblies i have in the box.
i am just glad that i have finished winding the transformers for now i can stop straining my arms and strain my brain instead lol

Cheers,
           Zogg

[oztules]

Yep the transformers test out your strength and stamina.

New power board awaits capacitors, and making heat sinks for it .... good looking strong board it is too.. pj should copy you.

The control works as expected... very well.... single sided is fine..... but must have holes on the pdf.

For the cost of a PJ you could buy 100 lifetimes of 8010's Probably a lot  better than nano to emulate it.

Zogg, If you used a tl494 instead of the 393, then you could use the dead time to limit the voltage to 12 from 60 easily enough... I may do one of them soon for that very reason... just vary the deadtime for whatever voltage you use.... basically uses the inductance of the motor as the inductor for a buck converter, and fiddle the pulse width for the speed proper.... so deadtime for speed max, and pwm for motor speed based on temp.

Then you could use the 12v on the control card as only milliamps are required for the tl494... battery  direct to the fan/s.



...............oztules

[billy]

Oztules,
 does any thing have to be changed when hooking your control board to a pj main board?

thx
Billy

[oztules]

Yes... you must replace the gate resistors with 4r7 ohms, and use a diode across then for faster turn off..... as in this:



Other than this, nothing else need change.
If you don't change these, it will get very hot very quickly.

..............oztules

[billy]

thx Oztules.

are those on the old boards, I have one of their new type with removable mosfet boards?

Billy

[oztules]

yes, I expect so.

I believe the new boards are surface mount... so easier to remove and replace.... and piggyback the diode.

................oztules

[billy]

Ok Oztules,

thanks again.

Billy

[peter]

Further info on the aliexpress inverter board.

It comes with hard start enabled by default. This was OK for me in testing
when the primary winding was using 16AWG garden lighting cable.
I wanted to test now with a bigger load, 500W. This means a proper winding.
I have on hand dual 6mm2 solar panel cable and so I wound 18 turns of this.
Now the DC resistance of the primary plus inductor came down to 0.024 ohms from
0.130 ohms as with the 16AWG cable.

This gave the inverter board a much stiffer load on start up. The hard start was too much now for the power supply.
Clearly it's time to use the soft start from now on.

18 turn primary was needed because I will be supplying power via 2 x 12V 100AH and wanted a bit of headroom.

I show (first 3) below the soft start and shut down waveforms with zero load in the first two DSO captures.
Right at the time the inverter is enabled there is a tiny high voltage transient
but it's not too much of a problem to my mind.
AC volts is blue, DC supply current yellow. Full scale current is +/- 2.5V = +/- 48 Amps
Pink is the enable input.

The inverter board has a LM324 4 way opamp providing 4 user settings to control the board.
One trimpot does the DC supply low voltage cut off. The output is sent into the on board relay
and then to the soft start function. The LV cut -off has hysteresis so with a setting of e.g. 21.4V cut off
it restarts at 24.7V. This seems reasonable.
The next trimpot is for DC supply high voltage cut off. I can see not use for it as built on this board.
I could not get it to function with DC supply voltages less than about 50V. It's useless.
Again it's output goes to the on board relay.
Third is AC current limit and it drives the on board relay, then soft start.

The forth trim pot drives the EGS002 IFB pin, via input from the DC supply current shunt sense.
This works but it is likely going to be a cause of blown mosfets. I triggered this by placing 12V
on the current sense opamp input and captured some resulting waveforms.
As a result of this work I plan to permanently disconnect the IFB signal from the inverter board
and instead route it's opamp output again to the relay (and soft start).

Note the high current pulse, extending for 5ms. This has maxed out the current sensor at 48 Amps.
During this test I had a small halogen lamp as a 240V load.
The pink is the dc voltage on the IFB input to the EGS002 board, on C24.
The last DSO capture shows how fast the IFB signal can control the mosfet swtiching, generating very high current transients.
There is no low pass filtering of this signal.

So far I would rate the inverter board as a great starting point but you will need to disconnect the
external link they build that is soldered onto C24 on the ESG002.
Then change it over to soft start and you will have a very strong inverter driver board.

Peter.

[frackers]

While I wait for a  User Journal, I'd thought I'd start putting together a wish list of capabilities and interfaces for a generic controller/logger for a solar/battery/inverter/gridtie system. Ideas are initially driven by what I can get cheap as a series of modules.

The brains of it would probably be this
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/mini-Stm32f103c8t6-system-board-stm32-learning-development-board/1568685935.html
with maybe a wifi interface
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/1pcs-ESP8266-remote-serial-Port-WIFI-wireless-module-through-walls-best/32280714838.html
and/or an RF interface to a remote station (goes further than wifi)
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/2pcs-lot-Special-promotions-1100-meter-long-distance-NRF24L01-PA-LNA-wireless-modules-with-antenna/969949629.html
and maybe an SD card for local storage
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/MicroSD-card-module/32530917432.html
Display would be either character display like this
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shipping-LCD-module-Blue-screen-IIC-I2C-2004-5V-20X4-LCD-board-provides-library-files/1873368596.html
or a more graphical display like this
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/J34-Free-Shipping-2-8-Inch-TFT-Color-LCD-SPI-Serial-ILI9341-Panel-Screen-Display-Module/32436568650.html
although that may use more memory than the 64k available on the cpu

DC side I've always used a DS2438 battery monitor chip ($1 each) which uses a shunt for current measurement and has a 10 bit A/D converter for voltage input. The great thing is that it does charge counting (30 times a second) so you can read amp-hrs straight out of it and it has a temperature sensor to read background conditions (you wouldn't want to glue it to a heat sink though!!)

AC side I'm thinking current transformer and transformer for voltage for isolation (although they will both likely require calibration). Other options are balanced high impedance inputs (couple of 10meg resistors to a differential A/D input) for volts and a Hall effect for current but I'm not impressed by the connections on some of the so called 200amp items.

Temperature sensors, I  would use 1-wire like the DC side measurements (since the interface code is already there!!)
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/1pcs-New-Digital-Temperature-Temp-Sensor-Probe-DS18B20-For-Thermometer-1m-Waterproof

and mosfet buffered outputs for PWM controlled fans as well as LED indicators, buzzer
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Four-Channel-4-Route-MOSFET-Button-IRF540-V4-0-MOSFET-Switch-Module-For-Arduino/32294024692.html
and relays.
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Free-shipping-2-channel-relay-module-relay-expansion-board-for-arduino-5V-low-level-triggered-2/1885697835.html

Have I got everything yet?

[dochubert]

Oztules,
I plan to switch to ozcontrol 8010 on my 15kw powerjack soon as I can get one.
 On changing the gate resistors to 4.7 ohms and adding the diode (for Billy's 24v pj), is that value resistor and diode correct for 48v units too?  Also, after being changed, can I still switch back to the pj control, or do the resistors need to be original values for the original control?
Thanks

[oztules]

" On changing the gate resistors to 4.7 ohms and adding the diode (for Billy's 24v pj), is that value resistor and diode correct for 48v units too?"
Yes, the same.

" Also, after being changed, can I still switch back to the pj control, or do the resistors need to be original values for the original control?"
No idea, I expect so... I don't expect to retrofit the PJ, ....


..........oztules

[dochubert]

Thanks Oztules,
While I intend to build a complete unit down the line, first I need to get this 15kw unit working properly.  I have to change the fets anyway, so figured to change those gate resistors at the same time.  Trouble is, don't yet have an 8010 to put in so will be using my spare pj control until I get the 8010, assuming it will work with the new gate resistor values.
Or maybe I should just not change the resistors yet

[oztules]

Leave it alone until your ready to do the 8010... may find the new pj board will last for years.


...............oztules

[Dr_Zogg]

howdey all,
I have been drafting up a bill of materials for my control board, fan controller and gti cutout and was wondering if i could get you to clarify a few components for me?
they are the ones marked with ??
thanks for the help



Fan controller

resistors
47k         X1
10k         X3
50k trimpot X2

Diodes
3v zener    X1

semi's
IRF640 ?    X1 is this suitable?
LM339       X1


Gti cut out

caps
100uf electro X1
25uf  electro X1
100n       X1 ?? what type of cap is this?

diodes
1n4007        X2
20v zener     x1
40v zener     X1
5v  zener     X1
red led       X1
grn led       X1

resistors
1w 270r       X1 ??1W?
1w 560r         X1 ??1W?
1k5         X3
15k         X1
12k         X1
5k6         X3
20k         X1
5k trimpot    X1


Misc

LM339        X1
CD40106        X1
IRF640        X1



CONTROL BOARD

Caps
4.7uf        X5  ?? can i use tantalum??
100n        X9  ?? what type are these?
100uf 63v    X1
10uf 35v     X6  ?? correct voltage?
22pf ceramic X2
1nf          X1  ??plastic film capacitor??


Diodes
13v  zener   X1
5.6v zener   X1
1N4007        X12
led          X1


Resistors
5W 120r      X1
10k          X4
100r        X2
1k        X3
50k        X4
0r        X10
2k  trimpot  X1
10k trimpot  X1

xtal 12mhz hc49/us  Is 12.288mhz ok?