Anotherpower.com Forum
Transportation => Fossil / Other Fuels => Topic started by: Burnit0017 on September 09, 2013, 12:09:07 pm
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Hi, because I live in a low wind area, I started a steam engine project. The converted engine idea was from many other project on youtube. The engine conversion was made by modifying the cam using JB Weld to add two extra cams. The monotube boiler is more challenging. It run out of steam after 30 seconds. I fabricated a manual fresh water feed pump but it does not work well if at all. Another problem is the rocket stove after the grate fills with embers and the fire dies down. Searching for solutions, suggestions are welcome.
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very nice machine ......it did,nt take you long to get it up and running as well , must be tempting to think about what you could hang on to it
what about the steam pressure ....does it need any kind of over pressure vent ?......
very nice ...
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Hi, this is a first attempt at using steam. Safety is a MAJOR concern. There a over pressure safety release valve the triggers at 110 psi. I read that monotube boilers are safer than other types boilers. I have to add a fan to the rocket stove. The main problem is the water feed pump. Because the boiler is a monotube, water has to be constantly add to the boiler when operating the engine. The water feed pump has to generate a pressure high than the boiler pressure so the water can enter the boiler. I am currently modifying a small air pump to use a water feed pump. Hopefully it will work but I am not sure. To be useful it has to operate a lot longer than 30 seconds. ???
40 psi is the target operating pressure.
All the problem areas have been identified and hopefully I will have it running before it snows. I will post results when available. Suggestion are welcome.
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system drawing
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He's baaaaaaaccck! 8)
As always, nice looking setup. Wondered what you were up to, we now know... Looking forward to seeing more :)
Steve
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You have put a lot of thought into it, and it looks pretty good. Only thing that comes to mind
is to make sure your PSV (overpressure valve) is big enough.
Well done.
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http://modernsteampower.wordpress.com/2012/08/08/homemade-wood-fired-lamont/
Hi, from the information that is a available all the parts for the pumping is rated at about max 500 psi. The system is small and I am keeping the fire really small until I understand how the system works. The article show what happens if there is a system failure. The over pressure valve is set to trigger at 110 psi. If the OPV ever triggers I will open the output bypass valve to quickly release all the pressure. Safety is always a real concern.
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He's baaaaaaaccck! 8)
As always, nice looking setup. Wondered what you were up to, we now know... Looking forward to seeing more :)
Steve
Hi, completed the vawt project and after testing last winter I realized that live in a low wind area. 99.9% of the time the wind speed for my area is below 8 mph. So I started the steam project. What I learned from the vawt project, PMA and MPPT info will be applied to steam project. No or low wind, No power. :'(
I am converting a small air compress pump to work as a water feed pump for the boiler. I will post results when available.
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boiler modifications: added steam drum, using air compressor pump as fresh water feed pump
hope to test in a few days then I can start to insulate
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Hi, I used JB weld epoxy to fabricate the additional lowbs on the cam of the 4 stroke. It did not last long, I was able to scrape it off with my finger nail. It just can't take the heat. I have to refabricate the additional lowbs. It was a good learning experience.
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Iv used JB weld for many things, some work well, but others didn't fare so well. Any which way, its all fun to learn what works and what does not.
My latest was sealing a 90 degree elbow in an oil pan to us e to relocate the drain for the boat.
This worked but was very slow to drain.
I have the engine out again as a new engine problem came up, and found the JB weld really held well.
In fact it held so well when I wanted to remove the elbow to drill and place a larger pipe, I broke the elbow off instead of breaking the JB weld trying to get it out.
I have also used JB weld to rebuild impeller pump surfaces with a lot of luck.
I have on occasion used JB weld to recondition badly corroded carbs.
I have learned that it works well in iron carbs, but in aluminum carbs in extreme temp environments, the JB weld will crumble as things contract.. I found this unpleasant surprise one spring after failing to be able to start an ATV I did this with.
Ahh well its all fun, anything I really need done right, I wont leave it to chance.
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Hi, the JB weld was rock hard but after a short time the steam turned it into a soft rubbery state and it just fell apart. There are problems with converting a 4 stroke to a engine. The oil pan fills with water. At some point I will have to get a standard steam engine.
The added steam drum to the boiler was a bad idea. It acted like a condenser and the system pressure never exceeded 16 psi. I removed the steam drum and I am using a air compressor pump as a water feed pump. The new water feed pump works well but the oil pan also fills with water. I did a hydrostatic test of the boiler and max pressure is 80 psi with no leaks. I ran the boiler for one hour and from a cold start it reached 60 psi in 10 minutes. I open the bypass valve and as long as I was pumping water into the boiler it maintained 40 psi.
The mono tube boiler is working, once I solve the engine problems I can connect a PMA and start to determine how current it will generate.
I will post results when available.
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the engine is running again
new cam modifications, work on boiler control circuitry
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Not a valid youtube URL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yVgEixbDoY8
Hi, I found this video of a manually operated monotube boiler, check out the second attempt. I am taking a few days to modify my boiler.
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Hi, converted to 2 cycle to steam. Requires min of 40 psi to operate. As the fire increased I could observe the engine RPM increase. Longest run was about 3 minutes. When the fire dies or the boiler runs out of water the pressure drops. Working on larger firebox and finding a better water pump. Suggestions welcome.
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Hi, I made a larger fire and ran the 2 stroke for more than an hour at 40 psi. As the piston returns to TDC there is back pressure that limits the power and RPM output. I am adding second cam and air valve to remove the back pressure. Will post results when available.
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Hi, I completed the 2 stroke modifications. I add a second air valve to release the back pressure that was created when the piston returns to TDC. The first test did not go well. I will have to adjust the cams and try again.
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Hi, project update. Simplified 2 stroke conversion. Now working on automating the water pump and connecting a PMA to the drive shaft.
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Started design for easy to fabricate double action steam engine. Original design found on internet. Just minor modification for twin cylinder.
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Hi, I was using a air tank safety valve for the safety valve on the boiler. It did not last long. I found a DIY safety valve that I was able to fabricate. Testing soon.
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Hi, I was using a air tank safety valve for the safety valve on the boiler. It did not last long. I found a DIY safety valve that I was able to fabricate. Testing soon.
Here's one I made a few years ago...
http://house.albury.net.au/LowPressureValve.htm (http://house.albury.net.au/LowPressureValve.htm)
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Hi, nice work, thanks for posting. It is great to have more than one option.
What are you using for a water pump????
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Hi, I solved my water pump problem. I was using a 4 inch black iron pipe for a piston cylinder and was getting a lot of blow by. I replaced it with a brass pipe and now I am maxing out the 200 PSI pressure gauge. The water pump is a major part for the the boiler and hopefully the problem is solved. Working on adding a DC motor to drive the pump.
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Hi, I started collecting materials to fabricate a small steam engine. The project is to gain metal fabricating experience.
The engine design will be loosely based on the Stuart Sirius twin cylinder using a rotary valve steam input and uniflow exhaust.
http://www.john-tom.com/MyPlans/SteamPlans2/HowToArticles/How%20To%20Make%20A%20Model%20Steam%20Engine.pdf
I am using pieces from the scrap bin.
(http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa124/elementsking2/engine_zpsb3fa9004.jpg)
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Hi, I still had water in the monotube boiler and the night time temp went below freezing resulting in a burst pipe. I will have to remember to blow out the boiler with compressed air in the future. :'(
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Ouch.
An ugly reminder of some of the troubles northern climates create.
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:DHi, I started fabrication of steam engine. Drilling a 1 inch hole 1.75 deep is harder than I thought. Half of the hard part is over and one more to go. Drilling multiple small holes inside the 1 inch diameter was easy. Drilling out the 1 inch hole took a lot time. For future projects it may be worth the added expense of using brass or aluminum for the piston cylinder.
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Hi, just a update of the piston block. I had to sharpen the new drill bit set from Harbor Freight and tighten the belts on my drill , mill, lathe and now I am able to drill the piston cylinders in more responsible period of time. This a first attempt and a learning experience. Not perfect but now I can move forward. I still have to drill the rotary valve and uniflow ports.
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Started fabrication of crankshaft, this is a first attempt. First time building a project without CNC and I am not a machinist. :-[
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Hehe this is cool... I was almost instantly taken back to one of the first pictures I saw of one of the the Wright brothers engines... Only this is better.. It's kinda like watching it being built ;)
Rock on man, definitely looks like at the very least it's quite an experience 8)
Steve
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maybe not a machinist, but looks to me that you are doing just fine. Fun to see
it being built.
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Hi, re-worked the crankshaft, added small bearings for the piston push rods and valve push rod on the shaft. I have to add DRO's to the mill axis's and buy a milling vise. It will be interesting to see if it does not fly apart at high RPM's.
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Hi, my cam shaft is so poorly fabricated it is just not working for me :o, so I found a design that does not use a crank shaft ::).
I plan to use some brass 1 by 3 pipe for the cylinders. Hoping for better results. pistons will be 1 inch aluminum with silicone o rings.
basically following these plans for the main idea, just increasing the scale a small amount
http://www.homemetalshopclub.org/projects/scotchx2/scotchx2.html
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Did the cold stall your project?
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(http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2804.0;attach=10774;image)
Hi, just a quick photo, the project is starting to take shape
>Mod edit. Photo link is broken. If you would like a (free) account and album in the anotherpower picture gallery message kurt or Wolvenar<
>There are no size or number of files limits <
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Did the cold stall your project?
Hi, I had to order a milling vise. Plus it takes a long time for me to cut and square the rough metal :D
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http://npmccabe.tripod.com/runrschemat.jpg
Hi, for version 1 I decided to use a simple valve configuration. I completed the scotch yoke that will drive the valves. I still have to complete the drive shaft cam.
(http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2804.0;attach=10891;image)
(http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2804.0;attach=10893;image)
(http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2804.0;attach=10895;image)
(http://www.modelenginemaker.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2804.0;attach=10897;image)
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Hi, just a basic photo showing the layout. I hope this solves the viewing problem.
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Hi, nice design, very similar to what I am trying to fabricate.
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http://gallery.anotherpower.com/main.php/v/Burnit0017/Scotch+Yoke+for+Scotch+Boxer+Steam+Engine.mp4.html (http://gallery.anotherpower.com/main.php/v/Burnit0017/Scotch+Yoke+for+Scotch+Boxer+Steam+Engine.mp4.html)
just for fun
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Greetings, I still have to fabricate a few parts. Happy Holidays
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Hi, just a few few photo's. Starting to bolt parts to base plate. The teflon piston ring will stretch. Hoping for less blow by.
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Wow thats really starting to come along.
Nice work!
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Hi,thanks. I still have to run steam lines and remove a few knocks. It is a real finger cruncher. ;D
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Burnit0017 the gallery does video to, so if you would like to upload vids to that your welcome to upload your vids to that as well and link.
Not sure if the last was a link to yours but..
Again just an offer
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Hi, I sent the winter fabricating version 2. Video of first run on air. Still waiting for warmer weather then I can try steam.
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All the pieces moving back and forth, as they should. Congratulations.
Cold weather, and steam isn't that good a mix first time out.
Like you, waiting for the hot stuff.