Author Topic: solar laminates  (Read 21259 times)

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Offline birdhouse

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #30 on: February 22, 2012, 10:21:52 am »
a word of caution, the glass on the face is tempered.  though incredibly strong in most all circumstances, there is a weakness.  the corners.  if the corners of the glass are bumped/dragged ect, there's a possibility that the whole piece will shatter into hundreds of pieces. 

once the corners are protected/encased, the glass is darn near framing hammer proof. 

adam

Offline philb

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #31 on: February 22, 2012, 06:57:33 pm »
Thanks for the heads up birdhouse. I suspected they are fragile since they are only 1/8" think AND glass.
The panel plus silicon came out to about 1/4". So I'll look for 1/2"X1/4"X1/2" aluminium 'C' channel locally as I haven't found any on line that seemed reasonable.

I found grey electrical boxes at the big chain hardware store. The boxes are a little smaller than the original J boxes but cost $1.21. It's an Old work single gang 8 cu in that's about 1 inch tall. I'll find some Krylon black plastic paint to make them look factory made.

What type of wire is recommended? I'm guessing it will be an SJO if it is to be ran outside of conduit. Sound right? More research needed...

Offline birdhouse

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #32 on: February 22, 2012, 11:54:47 pm »
phil-
i have two laminates very similar to yours.   mine aren't installed yet either.  i've got frames/j-boxes on them though  i like to run PVC conduit to another j-box, then connect the two j-boxes with a flexible ext. whip.  then you can pull wire.  i guess i do it this way because i adjust the angle of the mount with the seasons.

go to a voltage calculator to check for wire size and and shoot for less than a 3% voltage drop if you can afford it.

adam   

Offline ghurd

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #33 on: February 25, 2012, 06:35:02 pm »
What type of wire is recommended? I'm guessing it will be an SJO if it is to be ran outside of conduit. Sound right? More research needed...

SJOW, maybe.

Keep in mind you will need to get a waterproof /weather-resistant strain relief fitting that will hold the wire snug.  Nut tightens on a thick rubber gasket with a hole the size of the wire, and holds it quite well.

#12-2 w/g UF-B is what I usually use.  Can see it and the fitting in the pic I posted on the 1st page.
The US fitting needed 'screwed' into the unthreaded J-Box hole.

BTW, that pic was after the "roofer" and owner decided he could rip it off himself, replace the roof, and it would only need a squirt of silicone to fix it. (it looked like that when I got there to fix it)

Ross,
The O-rings with a thin center membrane I mentioned earlier were like what you were describing.  Not sure each would allow a cubic mm of displacement, but there were at least 4, maybe 6, per J-Box.  In those, needed to put a wire in at least 2 fittings, which didn't leave much diaphram action available.
G-

Offline rossw

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #34 on: February 25, 2012, 08:21:33 pm »

Ross,
The O-rings with a thin center membrane I mentioned earlier were like what you were describing.  Not sure each would allow a cubic mm of displacement, but there were at least 4, maybe 6, per J-Box.  In those, needed to put a wire in at least 2 fittings, which didn't leave much diaphram action available.

Yup, I know the ones you mean. And yeah, they don't allow much movement.

It's pouring rain outside, so I don't want to go topside and open boxes for a photo... so here's a rough mock-up.

An IP67 rated box. Seals tight... but summer to winter will almost always end up sucking something in if there's even the smallest hole.  A standard nylon gland, a good quality party balloon. Missing from here is a filter. Cigarette filter, wad of scrunched up flyscreen, whatever is at hand to stuff up the middle of the gland to stop critters getting past.


The gland. Nothing special. Any hobby-electronics store or electrical wholesaler will have them.


Take off the end that closes it. This would normally be the "outside", although I will be using it the opposite way here.


Roll balloon up and put over the end of the gland. A tiewrap around it is a good idea to keep it there.
Drill appropriate size hole in case, somewhere the balloon won't interfere with your installed goodies.
Put gland in from the inside, nut on the outside, tighten. Usually these things have a rubber washer to ensure a good seal.
Poke filter material up hole firmly, so the air can pass but critters cannot.


I've used this in places it was nearly impossible to keep a box sealed and dry, and had years of perfect operation from them since. (Ideally, a second, sealable hole, and I blow in some inert dry gas to charge the box before completely sealing it)

Offline ghurd

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #35 on: February 25, 2012, 08:38:57 pm »
Yup!  Thats the ones!
(the box was 100% non-corrosive, non-magnetic, genuine plastic)

In this hemisphere's side of the perpendicular hemisphere, its pretty difficult to get suitable wire that fits in those Metric things.
Most wire here is too small or too large (OD).
I would guess thats why the PVs were cheap.

Luckily, I live in a steel mill area, where most of the wire manufactures wholesale distributors have a fairly serious on-hand supply of unusual stock.
Suitable wire that fit was crazy expensive.
G-

Offline oztules

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #36 on: February 25, 2012, 10:29:12 pm »
That balloon is damn cunning Mr Walker...


I'm liking it


..............oztules
Flinders Island...... Australia

Offline tomw

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #37 on: February 26, 2012, 03:43:18 am »
That balloon is damn cunning Mr Walker...


I'm liking it


..............oztules

Who the hell is mister Walker?

The balloon guy is a wheeler not a walker. One needs tires the other needs shoes!

 :D ;D :o

I love it when I can keep a fight from starting by the application of a bit of silliness.

Tom
Do NOT mistake me for any kind of "expert".

( ?° ?? ?°)


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I thought that they were angels, but much to my surprise, We climbed aboard their starship and headed for the skies

Offline rossw

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #38 on: February 26, 2012, 03:48:29 am »

Who the hell is mister Walker?

The balloon guy is a wheeler not a walker. One needs tires the other needs shoes!

"Mister who walks"?
Only I don't have the fancy skull ring :)

Offline oztules

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #39 on: February 26, 2012, 04:34:14 am »
Yes Tom,
It is remarkable how as we get older, we can think one thing and type another.

I'd like to use that for an excuse.... but while there is some truth to that... really I'm just stupid sometimes.... most times


...........Sorry Mr Wheeler..... and It's still damn cunning too.

"Only I don't have the fancy skull ring :)"... I still have the purple leather jacket to go with it somewhere.... gosh I'm gettin old...

................oztules (or similar)
Flinders Island...... Australia

Offline philb

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #40 on: February 27, 2012, 07:09:20 pm »
There may be simpler ways of doing a J box, but I dare say, not better.

I have discovered I will pay more money if the components are assembled from scratch than buying a completed IP67 box.

The single gang boxes are going back to the hardware store. You have me convinced RossW. 

I've never seen or heard of using a balloon in this way before, but it makes sense. I haven't found anything like that on the internet through my research. It's so simple. 


Offline philb

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #41 on: March 25, 2012, 09:14:48 pm »
Today, I got around to finishing up two panels from laminates. I used super-strut from a major DYI supplier. Instead of using bolts, they are welded together. The frames are made for the laminates to sit on top with a 1/4" border. This is an experiment to see which panel holds up better. It's upside down in this picture.  ;D



The first panel had its edges surrounded with butyl, aka plumbers tape and a 1/2" X 3/8" X 1/2" aluminium frame was cut and mashed into the butyl tape.





The butyl was trimmed with a dull pocket knife. This material was very sticky.

The framed panel was set on the frame and caulked in place with DAP 3.0 that Ghurd suggested. And thanks Ghurd, it worked better than any previous silicon I have tried. It cost $1 more per tube. I used two tubes on the entire assembly.

The second laminate was set without any aluminium trim. I used a strip of silicon on the two long edges of the panel and sealed the edges all the way around the panel with another bead. I'm sceptical about using the super-strut which is steel with the panels because the expansion and contraction may not be compatible.



Here is a photo  of the  completed experiment.


BTW, larger pictures are in here:http://www.anotherpower.com/gallery2/main.php/v/philb/laminates/

Offline bj

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #42 on: March 25, 2012, 10:36:09 pm »
   Looking very slick Phil, very slick.
"Even a blind squirrel will find an acorn once in a while"
bj

Offline rossw

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #43 on: March 27, 2012, 02:01:16 am »
I've never seen or heard of using a balloon in this way before, but it makes sense. I haven't found anything like that on the internet through my research. It's so simple.

So, you're calling me "simple" now?        ;D

Offline Wolvenar

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Re: solar laminates
« Reply #44 on: March 27, 2012, 05:33:13 am »
Brilliance found in simplicity, is what comes to my mind Ross.
Trying to make power from alternative energy any which way I can.
Just to abuse what I make. (and run this site)